Event triggered substitutions

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Razvanica
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Event triggered substitutions

Post by Razvanica » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:19 am

I'll try to explain this.
You have already noticed that substitutions in SP are not controlled by the manager. They only happen if a player is injured. My proposition is to be able to define before a match some events that would trigger a substitution and a possible tactic modification. Examples:
1. if a player gets a red card, switch to a more defensive style
2. if your opponent scores, replace a CM with a CF
3. @min.72, replace your LB
These are just 3 examples, but I hope you get the idea.

The problem is I don't really know if events like 1. and 2. are really important in SP. I mean, I don't know if the result depends on those events or it is exactly the opposite.
However, the list of events will be decided by people who know these things so I will continue the discussion using event 3 as an example.

At this moment, this feature would bring almost nothing. In today's SP, if you want to win a match, you choose your best 11 and a substitution at a given minute can't improve your team's rating, it only can decrease it (except some special cases where you don't play your best team and you decide to play a better player for 20-30 minutes). This is because ratings in SP don't depend on the time spent on the field, but only on the initial fitness of a player. So, if we want this substitution thing to work, the method of calculating the ratings should also change.
What I mean is, for example:
- Player A, initial fitness 100, plays 90 mins, rating 65
- Player A, initial fitness 100, plays 50 mins, rating 66

This way, a substitution might improve the total rating. Example:
- Player A, rating 65 if he plays 90 mins, player B, rating 64 if he plays 90 mins. Normally, this means you use player A and you get a rating of 65.
- Player A plays 50 mins => 66, Player B plays 40 mins => 66. So you got a total of 66.
The numbers I presented are just an example I use to prove the whole concept.

I realise this is an important feature and it will probably be hard to implement, and I don't expect it very soon, but it would be nice if we knew it will be available one day...

I believe it is clear that it would bring more realism and it would make the game more interesting, allowing the managers to add another "weapon" to their teams.
The only negative point I see, except the time spent programming it, would be that the game would be harder for new players. Anyway, the importance of a substitution might be calculated so it doesn't become crucial in a match and new managers could learn about it step by step (it would be just like individual orders).

I hope I didn't miss anything and I'll be waiting for your opinions.

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cruxify
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Post by cruxify » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:13 pm

Very interesting concept and good explanation, I can't think of any pros atm but admittedly I haven't thought about it too much, seems good, would add another challenging element to games and could require some actual good tactics, however the only downside would be that this would soon be integrated into SPMT so it would then tell you when to make subs for maximum ratings.

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C.A. Peñarol
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Post by C.A. Peñarol » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:31 pm

Well in principal, the player on the starting line up that later gets subbed, would loose less fitness. Also the morale increase would be split between the players accordingly to how many minutes each play.

I reckon it's a good idea, though it has been suggested a number of times before.

Also, not to promote or advertise another game here, but this game has that option to sub during games, basically with the ideas you put out. Maybe we can get ideas from this game?
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ADITYA
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Post by ADITYA » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:42 pm

when i was playing in a match,my cb got injured and replaced by a gk. :?
even i was having another cm in subs.

Razvanica
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Post by Razvanica » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:48 pm

C.A. Peñarol wrote:I reckon it's a good idea, though it has been suggested a number of times before.
I know it has been suggested. It's just I don't like people saying "let's do that" but not really explaining how they want it to be... I also don't like people who say "I am open to your suggestions" but who never accept any of these suggestions (but this is another discussion).
C.A. Peñarol wrote:Also, not to promote or advertise another game here, but this game has that option to sub during games, basically with the ideas you put out. Maybe we can get ideas from this game?
I don't play another game, I tried once or twice but they weren't much fun. That's why I am glad I found SP. I know there are other games that have this feature but I think it's rather hard to implement it in some type of frameworks, where the simulation is not really event driven...
cruxify wrote:however the only downside would be that this would soon be integrated into SPMT so it would then tell you when to make subs for maximum ratings.
:lol: You are right, I didn't think about SPMT...

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jamiehutber
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Post by jamiehutber » Sun Aug 24, 2008 3:32 pm

i think its a massive add on to the game enguie. Which is why it hasn't been implemented yet and maybe won't for the forseeable furture. Although its a very good idea and would bring another dymension to the game.

(Sorry for the bad spelling)
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mtshef
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Re: Event triggered substitutions

Post by mtshef » Fri Nov 28, 2008 10:32 am

really need substitutions :P :P

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SBroccoli
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Re: Event triggered substitutions

Post by SBroccoli » Thu Mar 05, 2009 10:04 am

I support this idea FWIW.

I can't see how much extra cycles this could take. If it really strains generating, simply limit the number of available substitutions. To two or something. And limit the number of triggers to a few.

There's a test version somewhere, isn't there? Maybe Sjarel could try it out before anyone dismisses it for being to heavy.
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