Variation in age-performance

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Should we give this a try?

1. Yes please!!!
20
65%
2. Oh No, no changes.
10
32%
3. It seems nice, but... Please let it know.
1
3%
 
Total votes: 31

Noppp
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Variation in age-performance

Post by Noppp » Sat Jun 06, 2009 8:14 pm

According to another topic, I have proposed the following:
(something like that has been proposed before, but a long time ago, therefore a new try)

At the moment, players will perform less starting at 31. Therefore they become as good as useless. The only one buying them, are new managers that still think they will manage to get high performances.

So I propose to start with a variation in age-performance.
A player states at his birthday, if he will retire or not.
You will get this message in your inbox:

"Player Antoin Delorge mentioned that he became 33 and has enough of professional football and so he started his last season to finally retire at 34."

The existing contract of the player will be updated to the maximum of one season. As for yourself you have two options: Use him or sell him. But when you decide to sell him, the transfer mentions that he will retire at 34.
With age, these players gain a little extra, so called experience, in a way that he can perform at maximum ability uptill his retirement. this with 100% morale and 100% fitness of course.
If you want to buy such a player, you can only offer him a contract that goes untill his next birthday. The maximum ammount of money you can offer for the transfer is his wage multiplied by the ammount of days he has left to play.
It seems fair to me that these older players lose fitness rapidly, as it is the case at the moment with 29-30 year olds.

Starting from 30, the possibility exists that you get such a message.
Besides the chance for a youth player, you now have another thing to look forward too:
"Will my best CF last yet another season or not?"

Also fair would be that your opponents cannot see that a player will retire on short notice. That way it will be harder to estimate the strength of your opponents, because some of his best players might retire in the middle of the season.

Let me know what you think about it
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Nemo
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Nemo » Sat Jun 06, 2009 11:21 pm

It's great
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daniel_texan
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by daniel_texan » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:50 am

I vote for it.

"Experience combined with age" should be one of the player characteristics(similar to morale) that can affect the performance of a old player positively initially, negatively towards end of player's career. Two factors, experience and age, should weigh against each other equally. This will also make the transfer market balanced.

A highly experienced 30 year old player should be as valuable as a 18 year old, inexperienced prospect, whilst the old player's value(and salary demands) will go down with age. In real life football, do we find so many young prospects being sold at almost always high prices than players around 30? I am not sure. A Kaka at 32 should worth as equally as a C. Ronaldo at 16.

I have tried to put this graphically in following plot, where
- 'age line' is a linear,
- 'age factor line' and 'exp factor line' vary inversely
- 'peak performance' is achieved when the two factor lines meet

To make this unpredictable, and let the managers keep guessing all the time, this peak time and nature of those curves can be made dependent on hidden skills of the players.

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Noppp
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Noppp » Sun Jun 07, 2009 9:17 am

Nice graph!
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Razvanica
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Razvanica » Sun Jun 07, 2009 11:32 am

The Romanian community proposed something similar here. Your solution seems a little more complicated than what we proposed, but any change in this area is welcomed.
However, you should realize that any feature that increases the average "lifetime" of a player in SP is not a good solution for the game, even if it would seem to make it more interesting, as the turnover is very important in this game. That's why we suggested to also have players who retire at 27 or 28 years. This would keep the average lifetime constant and it would make the game even more interesting.
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Noppp
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Noppp » Sun Jun 07, 2009 11:58 am

27, 28 years. many players doesn't have reached the 100% experience.
Before a player is maxed, you can't benefit from him.

The retirement age should be different for the players, so the strenght off your opponents isn't so easy to read.
Now we are watching the player sqaud from your opponent and check when it's players will reach the 31.
So you now, when he will perform less.

( sorry, my english isn't very well...)
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Razvanica
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Razvanica » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:40 pm

Noppp wrote:27, 28 years. many players doesn't have reached the 100% experience.
Before a player is maxed, you can't benefit from him.
Well, that would be your risk. You have to understand that your proposal needs this in order to keep the average life of a player as it is today. Otherwise the feature would just increase the average rating and this would seriously change the game.

However, what we are doing here is pointless, as I don't think that any serious changes will be brought to the game. If developers want to implement this, they can post here and then we can discuss it. This way we are just loosing time.
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Noppp
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Noppp » Sun Jun 07, 2009 1:11 pm

If developers want to implement this, they can post here and then we can discuss it.
On the dutch forum, Sjarel has responded to this, he means that the managers don't want an other random and he's reject the longer duration off a players carreer on top form.
I'm for sure that he will read this topic also.

Maybe we should players bring the age of retirement from 28 till 34 or so.
There has to be more variation in it, on my opninon.
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SBroccoli
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by SBroccoli » Mon Jun 08, 2009 8:46 am

I disagree.

The suggestion is far too complicated.

I'd prefer that 30+ players simply lower their salary demands so it follows max perf. rather than GR, which is grossly overrated when they get older.

This would make trading 30+ players a more fair deal while at the same time making it very transparant what to expect.
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Michal Kejchal
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Michal Kejchal » Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:12 pm

Noppp wrote:According to another topic, I have proposed the following:
(something like that has been proposed before, but a long time ago, therefore a new try)
Sure almost everybody would agree to implement something like this to make game more realistic. But why are you comming with this idea exactly at a time when some of your key players will get over 30 soon? It looks a bit strange then... :?

Noppp
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Noppp » Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:09 am

Michal Kejchal wrote:
Noppp wrote:According to another topic, I have proposed the following:
(something like that has been proposed before, but a long time ago, therefore a new try)
Sure almost everybody would agree to implement something like this to make game more realistic. But why are you comming with this idea exactly at a time when some of your key players will get over 30 soon? It looks a bit strange then... :?
:shock: :shock:
I play this game for 28 seasons now, i only missed the first season.
Every season there are keyplayers who are around 30 years old.
This has really nothing to do with it, what a crapp! :evil:
I want some changes in the game, because i'm worried about the future of my favourite game : Soccerproject.
Everything is too predictable now. There were once 44.000 managers, it's been down to 28.000.
This shows that the game is losing attraction.
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calin_g
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by calin_g » Wed Jun 10, 2009 11:21 pm

what bugs me in this affair is not whether the other managers are attentioned that an older player is gonna end his career soon, but the fact that an old player loses many performance points in a very very short term.. this should happen gradually, it should happen in a season or more. i mean.. no real life players performances drop from a match to another like that
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Notwell
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by Notwell » Thu Jun 11, 2009 8:34 am

SBroccoli wrote:I disagree.

The suggestion is far too complicated.

I'd prefer that 30+ players simply lower their salary demands so it follows max perf. rather than GR, which is grossly overrated when they get older.

This would make trading 30+ players a more fair deal while at the same time making it very transparant what to expect.
I think the right solution should be that the GR went down with the performance. This would however require skills to drop with age (permantly), and it might be complicated to change. Typically skills as speed, strength and stamina would be ones affected by age.

It doesn't make sense that the player keeps high skills which are not real, afterall it should be some degrading of skills which makes the performance poorer.

mayoboy
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Re: Variation in age-performance

Post by mayoboy » Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:52 pm

i do feel that the decline should be more gradual as opposed to a sudden drop. how difficult that is to program in i have no idea but it would make more sense imo. as notwell says, the overall rating should also decline gradually so the performance stays in relation to the rating. it seems a bit silly having high rated players being out performed by lower rated younger players, surely experience would help maintain their higher level of play (to a certain degree).

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